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I need to compute the following: $\frac{\partial}{\partial y} \left( \frac{ dy}{dx} \right)$. I understand that this looks funny and that it's not quite clear why I would want to compute that. The reason is that I will be optimizing something of the form:

$$I[y] = \sum_k h\left( \frac{dy}{dx}(x_k) \right)$$

or

$$I[y] = \int h\left( \frac{dy}{dx} \right) dx$$

I attempted to use the chain rule and found, for $g(y(x)) := \frac{dy}{dx}$, that:

\begin{align}\frac{d^2 y}{dx^2} & = \frac{d}{dx} \frac{dy}{dx} \\ & = \frac{d}{dx} g(y(x)) \\ & = \frac{\partial g}{\partial y} \frac{dy}{dx} \\ &= \frac{\partial}{\partial y}\left( \frac{dy}{dx} \right) \frac{dy}{dx} \end{align}

This allows me to solve for what I wanted and obtain:

$$\frac{\partial}{\partial y}\left( \frac{dy}{dx} \right) = \frac{ \frac{d^2 y}{dx^2}}{\frac{dy}{dx}}$$

However, when I think about this numerically, I would compute a sampled version of $\frac{dy}{dx}$ using some linear finite-difference operation, e.g. $\frac{dy}{dx} \approx Dy$, where $D$ is, say, a first-order centered difference operator. Then, I can compute the gradient of that with respect to $y$ and it is simply $D^T$ (an operator!).

So, I have two conflicting approaches and neither seems to be very clear. Does anybody have a clear idea of what's going on here? Thanks in advance.

  • In your expressions for $I[y], y$ varies over functions, not numbers. But $\dfrac{\partial}{\partial y}$ is defined for variables that vary over numbers, not functions. So basically, you are playing with symbols without any throught about what those symbols mean. And in this case, one of them doesn't mean anything. – Paul Sinclair Mar 22 '18 at 03:23
  • So I agree with you, except that when I put this discretely into a computer $\frac{\partial}{\partial y} \frac{dy}{dx}$ does have a meaning (which I can work out). In fact, the numerical approach suggests that $\frac{\partial}{\partial y} \frac{dy}{dx} = \left( \frac{d}{dx}\right)^* $. I am still unclear. – MatthewPeter Mar 22 '18 at 16:56
  • Your "put[ting} this discretely into a computer" and applying finite differences involves making a number of assumptions about the functions $y$ you are representing and the "derivatives" you are taking. Since I do not know exactly what you did, I cannot address what those assumptions are. However, if you want to look into actual operators of this sort, you should investigate the calculus of variations, and functional analysis. – Paul Sinclair Mar 22 '18 at 23:03

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